Stubb points out that Putin has now caused a permanent change in public opinion among Finns and Swedes.
"The train has left the station. Finland is moving toward full NATO membership," he says. "It's not going to happen today, it's not going to happen next week, but it will eventually happen."
Stubb also sees China as a lot more dependent on Europe or the US than it is on Russia. "But don't think for one minute that [...] the big partnership in the future is gonna be China and Russia,” Stubb says. Although Russia has natural resources, geographic size, and military power, its economy is very small.
Ten years from now, Stubb anticipates a Russia that will be as isolated as North Korea is today.
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